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A “Church of Christ” Member “asked” or rather stated: Does the Church have a name….what is it? I would be a shamed to say I was of any other Church, then the COC. Why? If you are in Christ, you have eternal life. Good Night!! Christ said, he was going to build his Church, did he……….Is it His Church? What name is it? On the day of Pentecost when Peter got up with the twelve, and the same day there were added unto them three thousand souls…..who’s Church were these people added to.

Where in the bible does it name the church as the “Church of Christ”. It doesn’t. Rom 16:16 says “Churches (plural) of Christ” being demonstrative of the differing congregations through out the biblical area. And Paul mentioned this also.

1Co 1:12-13ow this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ. Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?

Paul said there was unity among those “churches (plural) of Christ” in that they are not of Paul, Apollo, or Cephas. No they where “IN” Jesus. Paul the notes that his Christ given mission is not to baptize but to preach the gospel least the cross be made un effective.

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This was written in response to many post (which where basically just links to universalist site material) made in a MSN group by a Universalist named Rodger (associated with tentmakers.org).

If you will listen to what Universalist Rodger says, he says,, “Even though I was and am trusting for my salvation in what Jesus accomplished by His death and resurrection, through the power in the blood of His cross, I was, and still am unable to love a god who would let anyone suffer forever.”

I could not find the quote but he also says that anyone who does not believe “as he does for pardon of sins” is of the hook anyway. So how can he trust in Jesus for his sins and dedicate his life, as he has, to telling others not to do the same because it matters not? He does not realize that when a person steps into the realm of biblical teaching he should so with great discernment because of the higher level of accountability and yes judgment for all teachers of religious or God’s truth.

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christian suicide

These questions where asked in a forum I visit. WHAT ABOUT SUICIDE? Can it be forgiven? Is it not written that blasphemy against the Holy Ghost, is the only unpardonable sin? The questionnaire has yet to answer the questions himself, but his questions prompted this response and I would like to share it so that other may share it freely if they so wish. The questionaire advocates salvation by works.
______________________________

It always saddens me to see those that advocate “self salvation” to bring up suicide. It is always served with a generous portion of apathy and contempt for those who do commit suicide, and even those who are depressed to the point of considering it. There will always be someone that defines suicide as murder and try to state that murderers cannot be forgiven and end up in God’s heaven. The reasoning goes if you can save yourself you can likewise condemn your self. But the bible says that “all” are condemned already. From that we must be rescued.

But what does the bible say about murderers? It says they shall not have a place in God’s heaven. But when the Spirit of the new law of Christ says that we are ALL murders if we get angry at our brothers for no reason, it kind of levels the playing field huh? Like it or not we are all murderers! Have you not heard that if you break one of Gods laws you have broken them all?

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A “Church of Christ” Member “asked” or rather stated: Does the Church have a name….what is it? I would be a shamed to say I was of any other Church, then the COC. Why? If you are in Christ, you have eternal life. Good Night!! Christ said, he was going to build his Church, did he……….Is it His Church? What name is it? On the day of Pentecost when Peter got up with the twelve, and the same day there were added unto them three thousand souls…..who’s Church were these people added to.

Where in the bible does it name the church as the “Church of Christ”. It doesn’t. Rom 16:16 says “Churches (plural) of Christ” being demonstrative of the differing congregations through out the biblical area. And Paul mentioned this also.

1Co 1:12-13ow this I say, that every one of you saith, I am of Paul; and I of Apollos; and I of Cephas; and I of Christ. Is Christ divided? was Paul crucified for you? or were ye baptized in the name of Paul?

Paul said there was unity among those “churches (plural) of Christ” in that they are not of Paul, Apollo, or Cephas. No they where “IN” Jesus. Paul the notes that his Christ given mission is not to baptize but to preach the gospel least the cross be made un effective.

1Co 1:17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect. For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

The bible says we are saved by grace so that no man may boast, even as David and Abraham and all of his seed by faith have nothing to boast about. In contrast we are told to glory in the Lord and glory being “In the Lord”. It does not say to glory about being in any denomination or sect of Paul, Apollos or Cephas. No, The bible says to glory “in the Lord” or Glory about “being in the Lord” not anyone’s else’s faction.

1Co 1:27-31 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty; And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to naught things that are: That no flesh should glory in his presence. But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption: That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.

Although the Christian church is not called “the Church of Christ”, it is called the “Church of God” 8 times.

1Co 1:2 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours:

1Co 10:32 Give none offense, neither to the Jews, nor to the Gentiles, nor to the church of God:

1Co 11:22 What? have ye not houses to eat and to drink in? or despise ye the church of God, and shame them that have not? What shall I say to you? shall I praise you in this? I praise you not.

1Co 15:9 For I am the least of the apostles, that am not meet to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God.

2Co 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, and Timothy our brother, unto the church of God which is at Corinth, with all the saints which are in all Achaia:

Gal 1:13 For ye have heard of my conversation in time past in the Jews’ religion, how that beyond measure I persecuted the church of God, and wasted it:

1Ti 3:5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)

This denominating (naming as different from others) of the church as the “Church of God” (as opposed to church of Baal) here in the bible is abused by another authoritarian/sectarian alledged one true church. The Churches of God denomination. Denominating is just naming. like a 5$ bill is “denominated” as as a five and not a one,.ECT. When one claims to be the one true sect they become sectarian. When one claims a name distinguishing oneself from another group, they have become a denomination. YES the COC is a denomination.

The “one true church” is not any sect/denomination or faction. No the “one true church” is those “found IN Jesus” through his death on the cross and resurrection from the grave. So does the bible call the church “The Church of Christ”. NO IT DOES NOT! I defy you to prove it.

Some questions that need answering by the COC members: When and How did Jesus become a member of the Church of Christ? When and How did the Apostles become members of the Church of Christ? Do you recognize people who call themselves the “CHURCH OF GOD” as a part of the church? Does wearing a Scriptural NAME alone mean that BODY is a Scriptural Body?

Upon what grounds do you refuse to recognize the “Holiness” people who call themselves by the name CHURCH OF GOD? Where the members of “Church of God at Corinth” LOST because Paul failed to call them CHURCH OF CHRIST? Is it possible for anyone to be a Believer who is a member of a church that is not called the “CHURCH OF CHRIST“? Where there any Churches in the New Testament -not called by the name- CHURCH OF CHRIST? Where their members saved or lost? Is the term “THE CHURCH OF CHRIST” found as a TITLE to any one CHURCH in the Bible anywhere? Where was your CHURCH OF CHRIST when Alexander Campbell was being baptized by a Baptist preacher?

Does it matter if you call your church the Church of God, Church of Christ, Church of Jesus Christ, Church of Jesus Christ later day saints,, etc.

It is safe to say that the “COC” is not the “One True Church” as their sectarian/authoritarian rhetoric proclaims! Paul also addresses this issue in I Corinthians 12:12-31.

1Co 12:12-31 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ. For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. For the body is not one member, but many. If the foot shall say, Because I am not the hand, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body? And if the ear shall say, Because I am not the eye, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body? If the whole body were an eye, where were the hearing? If the whole were hearing, where were the smelling? But now hath God set the members every one of them in the body, as it hath pleased him. And if they were all one member, where were the body? But now are they many members, yet but one body. And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you. Nay, much more those members of the body, which seem to be more feeble, are necessary: And those members of the body, which we think to be less honorable, upon these we bestow more abundant honor; and our uncomely parts have more abundant comeliness. For our comely parts have no need: but God hath tempered the body neither, having given more abundant honor to that part which lacked: That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another. And whether one member suffer, all the members suffer with it; or one member be honored, all the members rejoice with it. Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular. And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues. Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles? Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret? But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet show I unto you a more excellent way.

NO “The Church of Christ” is an pseudo/Christian cult that has many unorthodox/aberrant and heretical doctrines! If you doubt that the “COC” is a cult, look into it’s teachings and spend some time interacting with some of it’s members. The attitude of the individuals and the denominational organization itself speaks volumes. They laughably imply perfect understanding of the word of God with their motto, “We speak where the bible speaks, and we are silent where the bible is silent.“ Their claim to NOT be a denomination, but “the one true Christian church’ is absurd and ridiculous. The “Church of Christ” is a cult!!!

Please visit our main site, and our forums @
http://how2becomeachristian.proboards83.com/

FOR ALL articles created and copyrighted by
Damon Whitsell 2008. Free duplicating is allowed
provided the Commons copyright licensing requirments
is kept intact and attached.

This was written in response to many post (which where basically just links to universalist site material) made in a MSN group by a Universalist named Rodger (associated with tentmakers.org).

If you will listen to what Universalist Rodger says, he says,, “Even though I was and am trusting for my salvation in what Jesus accomplished by His death and resurrection, through the power in the blood of His cross, I was, and still am unable to love a god who would let anyone suffer forever.”

I could not find the quote but he also says that anyone who does not believe “as he does for pardon of sins” is of the hook anyway. So how can he trust in Jesus for his sins and dedicate his life, as he has, to telling others not to do the same because it matters not? He does not realize that when a person steps into the realm of biblical teaching he should so with great discernment because of the higher level of accountability and yes judgment for all teachers of religious or God’s truth.

And His dilemma is the bible itself. It speaks for itself and not many sit down for the first time to read it and walk away with the conclusion of universalism because the whole point of the bible is anti/ universal. Jesus is the only name by which we MUST be saved. He is the only savior and he settled the wrath of God by his propitiating atonement redemptive death on the cross.

Rodger wants everyone to believe that God sent his Son to die and incur our wrath and appease the righteous judgment of God through his death, but that anyone and everyone will be saved anyway.

Why does Rodger set his own criteria for the worthiness of God for our love? IE, “I cannot love a God that”,,,, As finite created beings, are we worthy to say if our creator is worthy of love or not regardless of how he acts and what he chooses to do, and his criteria for us to be reconciled to him.

Mr. Universalist/Mr. Rodger. Why did Jesus die? Why did he have to die???????????

Universalist Paradox/Dilemma by Damon Whitsell by Damon Whitsell is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial-No Derivative Works 3.0 Unported License. Based on a work at http://www.how2becomeachristian.info/index.htm. Permissions beyond the scope of this license may be available at http://wiki.creativecommons.org/Spectrumofrights_Comic1.

Please visit our main site, and our forums @
http://how2becomeachristian.proboards83.com/

FOR ALL articles created and copyrighted by
Damon Whitsell 2008. Free duplicating is allowed
provided the Commons copyright licensing requirments
is kept intact and attached.

=======================================================

CLICK THE LOGOS ABOVE TO GO TO THE HOME PAGE AND LISTEN TO THE RADIO SHOW

—————————————————————————-

 

These questions where asked in a forum I visit. WHAT ABOUT SUICIDE? Can it be forgiven? Is it not written that blasphemy against the Holy Ghost, is the only unpardonable sin? The questionnaire has yet to answer the questions himself, but his questions prompted this response and I would like to share it so that other may share it freely if they so wish. The questionaire advocates salvation by works.
______________________________

It always saddens me to see those that advocate “self salvation” to bring up suicide. It is always served with a generous portion of apathy and contempt for those who do commit suicide, and even those who are depressed to the point of considering it. There will always be someone that defines suicide as murder and try to state that murderers cannot be forgiven and end up in God’s heaven. The reasoning goes if you can save yourself you can likewise condemn your self. But the bible says that “all” are condemned already. From that we must be rescued.

But what does the bible say about murderers? It says they shall not have a place in God’s heaven. But when the Spirit of the new law of Christ says that we are ALL murders if we get angry at our brothers for no reason, it kind of levels the playing field huh? Like it or not we are all murderers! Have you not heard that if you break one of Gods laws you have broken them all?

Do you think King David will be forgiven his adultery and murder? How can a murderer be a “man after gods own heart”? I submit to you YES and that it is because David realized that “in him” was no good thing and long before he had anyone physically murdered, he had said in his heart “RACCA” ( not deserving of forgiveness) in anger against his brothers and had already committed murder. Just like Abraham, David was justified in Gods site by faith and blessed is the man to whom God will not impute sin.

The “self salvation” folks show their spiritual maturity to be null and void when they take the line of reasoning that people who commit suicide cannot be saved. The see no value at all in the prefacing suffering. They would even ridicule ‘Christian suffering” and sport a bumper sticker that says “to blessed to be depressed”. They would look upon those that are not like wise “to blessed to be depressed” as beneath them and possibly not even real Christians. But the question is “what does the bible say about depression?”.

Some folks need to do a word study on suffer & suffering! Christ said we must share in his sufferings. Jesus is called the Suffering Servant in Isaiah 42:1-4. Isa 53:3 says of Jesus “He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.” Jesus said we like him shall suffer for his names sake. Paul shared in Christ sufferings. He often said he wished to be absent from the body and to die was gain and preferred. He only wished to hang around for the sake of those whom he had been given charge over (us gentiles and the churches he had planted).

Christ suffered and said my God my God why has though forsaken me? Remove this cup from me if possible. What was that cup? It was the cup of suffering! It is safe to say that in Jesus humanity he was depressed and not jumping for joy. But he went to that cross anyway because of the joy that would come from it afterwards. It was what he was sent to do!!! Do you partake of the cross and the cup of suffering?

Elijah spent three days under the juniper tree thinking about killing himself. Only a divinely sent visit from an angel with a good meal (from heaven) got him physically strong enough to get out from under that Juniper tree and want to live again. He did finally go and face the threat of murder but lets not forget that without divine intervention Elijah would have been finished under that juniper tree. And lets not forget Job who is counted among the numerous bible figures to say “it would have been better for me to not have been born !!!”

Imagine this !!!. You cannot grow if you only have one “mountain top” experience after another. You only grow in dependence on God and spiritual maturity in the valleys of despair and helplessness. We are clay and He is the potter. How quickly we forget that if clay had feelings, it would hurt the clay to be molded and formed into something. How quickly we become unsympathetic towards the clay.

Suffering will make us or break us. Wounds are ways to reveal us! The real us!!! Suffering, and the way we respond to it, will show us where we are at in our walk with God. Can a wild horse be tamed unless it is first broken? Can a servant of God make a good servant unless he is first broken and made into something else?

I realize that some do not have the temperament disposition to get depressed often. But even those less prone to depression will have valley experiences too. Life is not all fun and games ya know. Life is painful. More so to some than others. To live is Christ to die is gain. I’m so tired and so weary but I must go on. Till the Lord come and takes, takes me away. There will be no sadness , no sorrow, no trouble I see. There will be peace in the valley for me ! someday !!!

I believe that some that commit suicide are deranged and delusional and are not really aware of what they are doing. But I believe that most that commit suicide are just tired of living and hopeless. Kind of like when an 80 yr old man loses his companion and he just turns his will to live off and dies shortly afterwards. Is that suicide also???

But I hate to be the one to tell some of you, but suicide can be the biggest act of faith ever. I don’t buy into the idea that a Christian will commit suicide just because he is sick of living this life. If a Christian commits suicide, yes he is tired of living this life but he does not expect to just end it and life is over, he expects to fall into the loving arms of his savior and to be face to face immediately.

It is never Gods will for anyone to commit suicide. Yes Jesus told Judas to go do what he had to do but it was Judas’s will to die. Jesus did not hang him there. I don’t think Judas was in his right mind. After all he betrayed the one that loved him. That would be called “grieved to death” if you ask me.

It is really disparaging to interact with people who would have shunned Jesus in his moments of trail in the Garden of Gethsemane. People like to play with words and try to say killing is murder. Consider this, Jesus knew he was to be taken and crucified, he said so before Judas betrayed him. Since Jesus knew he was to be crucified, did he commit suicide or self murder because he did not flee but went willingly to the cross?

Can you really know how God feels unless you too have been scorned and utterly rejected by the ones you love? Ask Hosea!! Would it destroy your faith to know that God too gets depressed and is very empathetic to those who are depressed and broken ?

Blessed are the meek and the broken hearted. For theirs is the kingdom of God!!!

This article is created and copyrighted by Damon Whitsell 2008. All free duplicating is allowed provided this Commons copyright licensing requirments is kept intact and attached.

Suicide and Salvation by Damon Whitsell is licensed (FOUR YOUR FREE USE) under a Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial-Share Alike 2.5 Australia License.Based on a work at how2becomeachristian.info.

This comment was a response to the posting of this article in a MSN discussion forum. It is added to encourage you to share this article with anyone whom you may know that is struggling with the suicide of a loved one. To forward this to someone, click on the BLOG article title link to go to the article webpage and click the “SHARE” button at the bottom right of the page.

Dear Damon, In the last 6 weeks I have heard of 3 suicides in our area……. I cannot tell you how this has blessed me. One of these persons have greatly broken up a co-worker since he is the Uncle of the one who killed himself. I was beside myself. This has really been helpful to me. I have wept and wept and wept over these lives. Two I believed with all my heart, were truly born again. One would travel extensively to third world countries and contracted some sort of mind disease. (I forget the name of it.) I had a cousin years ago (not in the last 6 weeks) but several years ago (5 to be exact) that actually gave all he had to the Lord. I often wondered about him. I pray that God deeply touches your heart as much as this post has touched mine. It brought me peace. Thank you so much. Anonymous ( The writer has not given me permission to divulge their name)

Please visit our main site, and our forums @
http://how2becomeachristian.proboards83.com/

FOR ALL articles created and copyrighted by
Damon Whitsell 2008. Free duplicating is allowed
provided the Commons copyright licensing requirments
is kept intact and attached.